...continuing from https://forum.obarun.org/viewtopic.php?pid=6106# p6106

I had just finished upgrading a few packages in Adelie when I read your message, and a few days earlier there were some more. So yes it is active just very slow at times. I see it as taking cautious steps and developing an absolute stability record. Some of the last upgrades was the s6 suite of tools and library, which is 1 edition newer than in Obarun, but Obarun has 66 dependent on s6, so everything that possibly needs to adopt to it must be checked first. This is a system at the end of its beta, 1.0 hasn't really been officially announced, expect it any minute.

The guy that writes s6, Laurent Bercot, has joined Adelie, so he builds the pkgs as soon as he releases something new. Adelie boots with s6, but then handling services becomes a pain in the neck, so they use OpenRC. Don't expect a huge variety of desktop software but they support a few full desktops and a few wm. I use openbox. If I really wanted anything more I can borrow it from void-musl, most of it works out of the box. So if the firmware exists in void you can make it work on adelie, I hope.

If you can run virtual machines you can start adelie there, make an installation of the basic system, then locate the firmware you need, shrink the partition to be 90%+ used, make an image with dd, transfer it to a hard disk partition, check enlarge partition to what you anticipate it will use, and reconfigure the bootloader to its new home, and see if it boots. From that point onward you can play with it in chroot.

They also have the base system in an archive you can just copy in a partition and use obarun to chroot to it. It is probably easier-faster to do it this way. The pkg manager is pretty simple, apk update, apk upgrade, apk search, apk add xterm, apk del xterm.

Write here your specs of your cpu/mb and gfx and I can check for firmware in void.
Thanks so much for your help, I have just tried to run the iso on a VM but, weirdly, it always froze at the very beginning. So I created a bootable USB with dd and ran it on my Lenovo laptop. This time I was able to get to the login prompt, I chose "live" to play around and, as I remembered, I had not wireless connection. The wifi card is recognized by the iso, it's an Intel Wireless 3160 rev 93 controller, but when I type "iwconfig" I get "lo no wireless extensions eth0 no wireless extension". I have also unblocked all with rfkill, but it looks like I am missing the driver. My processor is an Intel Core i5-4258U and my gfx cards are an Intel integrated controller rev09 and a Radeon HD 8550M. I wonder how I could get these proprietary driver installed, I remember that I managed to do it from a second USB stick when I tried Devuan but I don't know if the steps are the same...
My only live copy of adelie was back from fall 2018, beta2 or something. I don't know if it has net-tools in it and don't know how to do it with ip command. If you have net-tools there should be ifconfig inthere somewhere, I think /usr/sbin (usr/bin can run by user, /usr/sbin and /sbin can only be run by root. So try % sudo ifconfig wlan0 up, then # sudo ifconfig to see what interfaces you have up and what not. It should be lo eth0 and wlan0. Then you have to configure wifi by wpa-supplicant in /etc/....

If it is the same iso you placed on disk then you must have something not configured right on virtualbox. Do you have the kernel's headers installed? How about virtualbox-host-dkms? After you install them since some of this goes to kernel, you have to reboot for VB to work. Is obarun's iso working on VB? That is your benchmark :)

Also, before you start it may be easier to have a partition ready to make the installation, if you are not an expert in using fdisk from console. It took me a while by installing wm and software to exceed 1GB with Adelie.
Hmmm my VM works perfectly with obarun and other live ISOs, it's very very weird :D The live iso I am using is the latest one, RC1 from February, and when i use the ifconfig command it only shows my eth0 interface (that I can't use since I have no ethernet port). However, my wireless controller shows up in the device list. Ifconfig wlan0 up didn't work, as it tells me that there is no such interface. I tried dhcpcd wlan0, other fail. When I reported the issue on their IRC channel, they wanted to know my specs and then they told me that they were sorry but there were no wireless drivers available for my laptop, and that hopefully they would have added something in the following release (I think they don't like non-free firmware, while I should need the iwlwifi-firmware or something).
Also, I want to dual-boot my system but I'm not so sure that Adelie could be harmlessly installed alongside another system. They are planning on adding a graphical installer called Horizon, maybe this could help but it should be only available with the official 1.0 version ships out.
UPDATE: LOL, right now I have noticed that they have just uploaded an "experimental" Horizon iso on their distfiles, going to try it immediately! :D
4 days later
Ok, tried and now sharing my experience. I have managed to get it installed and running after a lot of work, because Horizon is a net installer and, as expected, it didn't detect my wireless interface and I had to tether my smarthpone and use dhcpcd with the usb connection. The installer crashed until I set the boot to legacy (not BIOS) and finally it worked, installing a KDE Plasma DE. Then I tried to chroot and install grub as a bootloader: the grub package was successfully installed but the "grub-install" returned a "failed to get the canonical path of /boot/grub". Ok, I gave up grub and successfully installed rEFInd. After rebooting I got a kernel panic and I had to edit the /etc/fstab file, that had a wrong name for the root partition. Unfortunately, there wasn't any firmware installed, there wasn't even any /firmware folder in /usr/lib. So I downloaded and extracted the linux-firmware package in the proper location but this didn't work either, maybe because the system wasn't able to load the firmware or something like that.
Also, I noticed that many packages were a bit outdated, but the apk package manager really impressed me, easy and fast! I found a curious bug in the terminal: when I entered the "su" command, the following line started with a string of weird characters instead of my user name.
All in all, a very interesting concept, though still not ready for the daily use and, paradoxically, more suitable for older computers (they have admitted that Adelie is working better on BIOS than UEFI). I will try it again then RC2 version is out and, hopefully, ships with firmware.
First on the boot/grub problem, did a /boot/grub/ directory exist before you run /usr/sbin/grub-mkconfig -o /boot/grub/grub.cfg
and /usr/sbin/grub-install /dev/sda ?

If you got giberish or a prompt with su, is there a shell configuration on /root like .bashrc .zshrc etc?

I use obarun's .zshrc but make sure you your .zshenv includes all the adelie directories, /bin /sbin /usr/sbin .. lib ..usr/slib

Read also man locale locale settings with musl are a little different, can't remember the details but I remember there is a complexity there.

Here is the address for their list. It can go for months without a single email but if you ask people will respond:
Welcome to the "Adélie Users" mailing list! To post to this list, send your email to: adelie-users@ lists.adelielinux.org You can make such adjustments via email by sending a message to: adelie-users-request@ lists.adelielinux.org with the word 'help' in the subject or body (don't include the quotes), and you will get back a message with instructions. You will need your password to change your options, but for security purposes, this email is not included here. If you have forgotten your password you will need to click on the 'Forgot Password?' link on the login page.
On reddit they are less responsive (not as fast).
Yes, the /boot/grub folder existed with the grub.cfg file, but I am afraid that the installer is still messed up. Indeed, I tried to reinstall the system because I could not get any wireless connection, but with a bad surprise: the installer couldn't recognize anymore the filesystem of my empty partition! I ran the in-built partition editor and it regularly detected the partition as an ext4 Linux system, so what? That's why I cannot say anything about the Konsole configuration now, I have took a look at their mailing list archives and one of their developer had written that the installer will be ready in some couple of months..well, maybe better to wait a little fore a more stable image. Btw I have already sent 3 emails to the users' list, but they have all bounced back "awaiting moderation"?
Ok, I sent them a message on the list explaining your problem with the list and installation and asked a moderator to take a look at held messages.

Cliear the partition out and use a tarball image instead of the live. Basically you download the tar ball (tar archive compressed) and extract the entire content into the partition. Then you chroot into it and you add a kernel and bootloader, configure user and pw, create a valid /etc/fstab for the installation. You can do the fstab thing from obarun. Say the partition is mounted into /mnt
# genfstab -U /mnt >/mnt/etc/fstab

The current kernel for 1.0 repositories is easy-kernel-src-5.4.5-mc0-5.4.5-r3

I don't know how old the latest image is but current repositories for 1.0 release are:
# cat /etc/apk/repositories
https://distfiles.adelielinux.org/adelie/1.0/system/
https://distfiles.adelielinux.org/adelie/1.0/user/


I'm sorry I recommended it and you are having such a tough time

PS For some reason when chroot from obarun to it the shell may not function well if the environment is not set specifically for adelie (/bin /sbin/ /usr/bin /usr/sbin /lib /usr/lib) so apk may not work, if it doesn't try /sbin/apk update or upgrade , search, add, del, etc.
> https://forum.obarun.org/viewtopic.php?pid=6152# p6152
> > I have tried to help someone on a forum of another distro how to
> install Adelie but he keeps having problems. He tried to subscribe
> here but for three days he is getting an automated response that his
> messages are awaiting moderation. Could a moderator for the list take
> a look at held messages?

Thanks. I've notified the people who are able to look at the queue; hopefully those messages can be released soon. To fix this for the future I think we will try to have more people able to look at the queue. It sounds like they were using the experimental Horizon ISO, which has a few known defects in the various versions. From what I understand, EFI was not working in the 20200618 version because of a typo in what filesystem type the EFI system partition was supposed to be, and the 20200623 version (or earlier) may have issues on some BIOS setups. For firmware, Adélie doesn't ship any in the official repos, but APK Fission does. We're hoping that future ISOs we ship will include firmware from APK Fission with a clear user choice as to whether it's used or not. It sounds like when they tried to manually install firmware they put it in the wrong location - it needs to be /lib/firmware, not /usr/lib/firmware. For VirtualBox, support is still very much a work-in-progress, mainly because the developers don't really have machines that can run it handy. I think the latest development here is that the vboxvideo X driver isn't being loaded automatically, so it has to be manually configured. I think this is what causes the "freezing" effect on boot. If this is configured then BIOS boot in VB should work. We will have to think of some way to make this happen automatically. I'm not sure why Horizon was not able to re-use the empty partition; I will try to look into this when I have time. "failed to get the canonical path of /boot/grub" sounds like they either did not have one of /boot, /dev, /proc, and /sys mounted inside their chroot, or some combination thereof. It is great to get feedback on these experimental ISOs, but when users get frustrated they have to remember that they are experimental. The official RC2 images will be more stable.

Max
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You don't have to be sorry, on the contrary I really have to say a BIG thank you for your endless patience and all the help that you are offering :) you recommended me an excellent concept and being a stubborn guy I am sure I will make it ;) well, finally good news, I was able to install the default Plasma flavor! Maybe it's just a lucky coincidence, but instead of just choosing the mount point in the list of partitions offered by the installer, I opened the partition manager, closed it and selected the same mount point from the list. As to the wireless issue, Max sent me a message with a couple of link to APK Fission, and adding them to the repositories did the trick: finally my SSID popped up after rebooting! However, there was another problem: as soon as I entered the password for my network, I couldn't connect because I had to be root...and then I noticed that the shutdown and reboot buttons were missing from the launcher menu. Indeed, I only could shutwodn by pressing the power off button on my laptop. It's basically the same issue that I experienced with Obarun (https://forum.obarun.org/viewtopic.php?id=866&i=1) and that Jean Michel fixed by updating sddm. I will send another email to Max and let you know, again thank you very very much!
6 days later
Hey @ friedmushroom, maybe you have already read my newest post there, however this is a quick update. I thought I found a dirty workaround to get sddm start consolekit2, just appending "exec ck-list-session startplasma-x11" to a .xsession file (a previous attempt to create a similar .xinitrc file and call it with startx had failed). However, this won't solve the problem of the inactive power buttons, I have to open a terminal as root and manually type the commands every time.
That said, I think I created a blocker for their release (LOL) because they use sddm by default and it looks like this bug is quite hard to debug. Jean Michel had faced a similar issue and quickly fixed it, but I am afraid that his solution can't be reproducible on a system that uses a different service manager like Adélie. Just to play a bit, i have tried to use the same Obarun's sddm conf file in the pam.d folder and I couldn't even go past the login screen :D. Too bad they don't have an alternative DM to check out, like LightDM.
Well, s6 is already in there, just add 66 :)
I don't know where the sddm pkg defines the power functions and what they look like but it sounds like they execute something that fails. If you run sddm manually and it opens at another tty the errors will show on the original tty you started it. Also, shouldn't there be a /var/log/sddm.log?
They are not as hot as they pretend to be, are they? Or maybe they don't worry as much about DMs and desktops running. Performance wise, what does run, appears to be very lean and clean (low resources highly responsive system). None of this madness of dbus sending a message to elogind to check whether user has the right to execute the notepad gui!

They should rename it the NFE-linux (not for everyone) . :)
I am glad you made this noise about firmware and after nearly 2 years following their development I found out about this "other" repository they share with Alpine. Nobody told me when their initial beta2 kernel couldn't boot my machine.
To get hibernation and sleep work on Obarun I always have to install pm-utils which is deprecated by Arch. Need to install from AUR.
May be worth a shot for you if it's available for Adelie and see if it changes anything for you.

SDDM calls whatever command you define in your config override file (on Arch: /etc/sddm.conf.d/whatevername.conf or not safe: /usr/lib/sddm/sddm.conf.d/default.conf) in this section: 
[General]
# Halt command
HaltCommand=/sbin/shutdown -h -P now
...
# Reboot command
RebootCommand=/sbin/shutdown -r now
20 days later
Hey @ marianarlt, thanks so much for your hint, I had already noticed a thread that you opened to solve the issue with the power options. Unfortunately, all of the custom configurations for sddm didn't work with Adelie. I am not versed in DMs whatsoever but I highly suspect that there's kind of a conflict among sddm/ck2/dbus and indeed that's what they decided:

https://lists.adelielinux.org/hyperkitty/list/adelie-devel@ lists.adelielinux.org/thread/Q66EQCG35DEF4CTAQRRO24LSVFEPMJWY/

@ fungal_net, sad news..They also had to surrender to elogind domination in the end..
You should look up some problems found for slim and ck2, maybe it is of interest. From what I read if ck-launch/daemon are called from within a ck session then ck breaks. Could it be that there is some ck redundancy in sddm as well, therefore it just needs to have its setup configured so it doesn't do that.

Apparently whoever is in charge of ck2 doesn't seem too concerned of it being dropped because of these bugs. I would think that an adapter patch could be created that translates elogind functionality into ck2, like an elogind-dummy pkg.

Adelie's explanation on why they shifted appears very rational, I may not agree with the choices of what to support and to what extent they will have to make concessions for it to work, but their arguments are rational.
13 days later
Yes, I have read the project lead's reply and it makes sense, they are trying to offer a product that is simple to use for any kind of user, and ck2 or an elogind emulator would be too troublesome for them to maintain. Ok, I can live along with it, after all Adelie is always worth trying. The problem is that in the same announcement A. Wilcox wrote that the new iso would have been released the following week, but as of now it hasn't, I asked him twice in two weeks and the answer was the same: "we are testing it". Now I wonder whether testing a build takes longer than I thought or something is failing from their side :)
Back in 2018 I was told that 1.0 was going to be announced by Xmas... it seems santa dropped it off the flying carriage somewhere between elsinki and copenhagen...

1.0 repository exists and receives upgrades frequently .... but they don't call it official. So don't wait, it is a rolling distribution, even when it gets announced it will still be the same with your installation upgraded. You might miss the experience of their promised installer ..... ... whoop shit do as they say in my village.

Just don't remove you obarun installation to make room for Adelie ... It will take years for it to get to the level of development we have here, despite of Arch's obstacles. As for kiss, it will take years of development to get to where Adelie is. Fun objects of interest and curiosity but not a daily working system. Take this from a minimalist who doesn't use a DM or a desktop, just a WM and terminal to start things. I haven't been even using a mouse menu for a while.

If I was to accept the plague of elogind I might as well be using Void ... but I'll stick to Obarun since I have more control and feedback here than anywhere else.
Lol yes, Santa Claus is still searching his carriage ?? I totally agree with you, I can't wait forever for them, though their effort is praiseworthy and they are a small team with basically one mind with all his personal issues. But their development is much too slow and awkward for someone like me who needs a daily full working system, that's why I am gladly sticking with Obarun and maybe give Adelie one more chance only when their final stable release is out.

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